Tuesday Open Mike

Open MikeWelcome to this week's Tuesday Open Mike. I'm Mike and I'll be your master of ceremonies for the day.

Feel free to use this space to vent, rant, share a story and/or ask a question of the hivemind.

Open Mike on Toronto Mike


Share this entry

Comments (89 - click here to join in!)

Blind Dave

It's one last gasp of summer on the Prairies. Late 20s or early 30s all week!

I have to get my glasses welded today. I've been wearing my backup pair as my good ones snapped in the middle. Unfortunately they are the bendy type and welds don't hold very well. I've had a hell of a lot of unnecessary money hits this year. I don't need another $500 out of my wallet if I can avoid it. But I do need glasses rather badly...

September 23, 2014 @ 9:08 AM

Lyle Lanley

Great week of weather here in Toronto. Sunny days in the 20s. Perfect late September weather.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:34 AM

Mathman

I don't think even John Tory can blow his current lead. He's going to have to say something awfully stupid. I wonder what he'll come up with?

September 23, 2014 @ 9:35 AM

Vicky

Can ISIS do anything to us here in Canada?

Should I be worried?

September 23, 2014 @ 9:36 AM

Argie

@Vicky
It isn't so much what ISIS can do to us here - its are we a target for those who they inspire, who live here.

Of course, like most tragedies the chances are very slim but nevertheless, there are crazies who are easily influenced by this group. Many simply go overseas to join this fight/jihad but I'm sure there are many who have stayed behind.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:53 AM

Ryan G

@Vicky.

Yes, they can confuse us. Obama calls them ISIL, but CNN calls them ISIS.

The recent missile strike last night is just a big misunderstanding. See, we had been asking them via email to stop beheading our journalists, but maybe we've been using terrorists@isis.com instead of terrorists@isil.com.

Someone call IT. Or is it IS? Jesus what a fucking gong show.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:55 AM

this guest

How many years is beyond the pale in romantic
age difference.
Somebody I am conversing with online
is very very interesting.
The age difference?
23 fricking years. And I'm the ancient party.
To me this seems just too much.
I've heard 14 years max but maybe there's no rule.
Who am I kidding.
Of course there is a 'rule.'

September 23, 2014 @ 10:00 AM

this guest

ps
by 'rule' I mean
what is practical and realistic
In a thoughtful, mature
relationship
but as Leonard Cohen said
The old are kind
The young are hot
Love is blind
Desire is not

September 23, 2014 @ 10:05 AM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

For the love of Archer, can we please stop calling them ISIS!

September 23, 2014 @ 10:10 AM

this guest

ISIS is a goddess
of much importance
in the realm of interactive
mythology

these guys
with their stupid black outfits
and brutal brains
are not interactive figures
in the realm of
mythology


September 23, 2014 @ 10:13 AM

Ryan G

@Mike. Agreed.

Instead, to clarify they should just rip off the name of the 80's band Icicle Works, and in fact "Whisper to a Scream" could be their theme song, which seems appropriate.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:20 AM


519 Rob

@This Guest

You need to follow the 'golden rule'.
1/2 your age, plus seven.
That's as young as you're allowed to go.

I'm not making that up, it's in the Canadian Criminal Code, eh, like, there's legal precedent set in cases in law.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:34 AM

519 Rob

(I really hope someone gets that quote)

September 23, 2014 @ 10:35 AM

markosaar
Someone call IT. Or is it IS? Jesus what a fucking gong show.
Bwahahahahaha.

Also re: Archer, yes!

September 23, 2014 @ 10:46 AM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

I was a few years late to the Archer party, but I'm banging them off on Netflix while feeding the baby or whatever.

As an Arrested Development fan, it's fun to hear many of the voices in Archer. Each episode is only about 20 minutes, so it's a nice, tiny, fun bite. I dig it.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:48 AM

McNulty

@ Rob

Strange Brew!

September 23, 2014 @ 11:04 AM

Argie

Speaking of 80s music, I still think the most under-rated band of that time was The Payolas/Rock & Hyde. Great tunes & a great sound.

September 23, 2014 @ 11:10 AM


this guest

@ 519 Rob
that's an interesting golden rule. Under that a 30 year old could see a 22 year old.
okay. a bit iffy but not the worst.
And a 70 year old could be with a 42 year old.
The 42 year old might hold out a bit longer for somebody younger.
But using that formula the situation I describe works for me.
I still question the 'mix' though.
I haven't said how old I am but I am sure I'm one of the oldest people
here commenting.
Unless Cheryl used to babysit Bob Seger.

September 23, 2014 @ 11:46 AM

Douglas

As I finished off my last bit of coffee this morning, it occurred to me to make note to those who have not used a French press before: If you pour out the very last of the coffee from the press, when you get to the last few mouthfuls of coffee in your cup, mug or "swimming pool", make sure you swirl your coffee around, or be prepared for a powdery texture and much more intense aftertaste.

@Argie - Payola$/Rock & Hyde were great. As much as I love "Eyes of a Stranger", though, I wish stations would play some of their other tracks, too. Some Arkells' tracks sound like they are at least influenced by, if not sound like, Payola$/Rock & Hyde. Not that that is a bad thing.

To the few CFL fans that read here: Last weekend had four really good games. Emotionally, maybe not if your team lost, but they were all exciting with all kinds of great and/or interesting play. The east came so close to sweeping the west. I was at Tim Hortons Field to see the Tiger-Cats defeat the tough Edmonton Eskimos to win their third straight in their new home. Maybe the stands will actually be full for the next game. "Paid attendance" was 18,500, but I estimate 14,000, at best, in the seats, which are actually comfortable and have leg room for me, at 6'2".

September 23, 2014 @ 12:19 PM

519 Rob

@This guest

Like any rule, there are always exceptions.
Maturity level is still a big part of the mating ritual.

September 23, 2014 @ 12:19 PM

519 Rob

@Douglas
I totally agree about the CFL, that was a great weekend of football.
I'm a TiCats fan, so I'm happy to see that they've played much better of late.

September 23, 2014 @ 12:52 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Douglas

Is it possible your grounds aren't coarse enough?

September 23, 2014 @ 12:57 PM

Al The Royal Pain

@Douglas and @519 Rob

I saw the highlights of the Sask/Ott game and that looked like a crazy game! Will have to check out the other highlights from this past weekend.

September 23, 2014 @ 1:18 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

Holy shit is it nice outside.

Admittedly, yesterday was a little nippy and it took me 2km before I warmed up (although I was wearing shorts) but today is near perfect.

Sunny skies, warm air... if you can get out there, do so!

September 23, 2014 @ 1:24 PM

brad

lana in archer is super hot for a cartoon

September 23, 2014 @ 1:38 PM

Douglas

@Mike
There is always some degree of powder from the grind, even though I do "coarse". That, or the screen on the $6 French press isn't fine enough. Probably a combination of both. Still, for those who are new to French press-made coffee, bean powder is something to be aware of. Personally, it doesn't bother me, because I swirl my coffee as it gets near the bottom. It's a (bad?) habit I picked up years ago. Coopers Sparkling Ale ( http://www.coopers.com.au/#/our-beer/ales-stout/sparkling-ale/ ), an Aussie beer that I really like, makes you choose between lightly swirling the beer to keep the sediment suspended or stay at the bottom of the bottle. I swirl it, because I want to enjoy all of the bottle's contents.

I had to step out of the office a few minutes ago to see if I left a flash drive that I need in my car. No, it's on the kitchen table at home. Grr. Now, since it's so nice outside, I want to go for a bicycle ride! I had a lovely 26.5 mile ride on Sunday, with no ill effects yesterday. I was going to ride again last night, but I did not get to leave the office until close to 9 p.m.

September 23, 2014 @ 1:47 PM

Gump

@this guest

I'm now very intrigued by your love life (I'm on a boring never-ending status call). Married/divorced/widowed/free? Kids?
As for age - do you remember Grey's Anatomy? ER? St. Elsewhere? Emergency? Marcus Welby MD? Ben Casey?
Where did you meet this young lass?

September 23, 2014 @ 1:52 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Douglas

$6? Haha, that might be it...

I've tried cheap ones but found the best results come from $45 Bodum.

September 23, 2014 @ 1:59 PM

Argie

You can get a Bodum for around $30-$35.

My one complaint about press coffee is that its impossible to buy coffee that's grounded course - its always fine so I have to buy the whole beans and grind them myself.

God, my life is tough!

September 23, 2014 @ 2:13 PM

CQ

@Argie 11:10
The Payolas (spelt with a dollar sign instead of an 's') were the first rock band I watched in concert. And no, my parents weren't with me either. The music still holds up. Their other song, Hungry, is a lost favourite.

September 23, 2014 @ 2:19 PM

Marie

@Gump. How do you know that this guest is male? Was this ever divulged? I always assumed she was female. Did I miss something?

September 23, 2014 @ 2:53 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Marie

It's funny, but I've always assumed "this guest" is male, even though he/she has never stated his/her gender.

September 23, 2014 @ 3:16 PM

Marie

@Mike
That is funny. The tone of their writing suggests a female to me. Maybe he/she will keep it a secret.

September 23, 2014 @ 3:21 PM

Gump

@Marie+Mike

That is funny. I had the same impression as Mike, in that "this guest" is male. I guess I figured no female would waste their time arguing with Argie -- they're smarter than us knuckle-draggers.

September 23, 2014 @ 5:40 PM

Cheryl

I don't like the CFL, but like the NFL. Anyway, my Orioles have to do better tonight. They really do. They didn't play well last night at all. Anyway, here is an album you have to get. Download it from ITunes, it's cheaper. I love the new album by John Mellencamp called Plain Spoken. It's a must have. It's all awesome and it's the best he has ever done. If you guys didn't preorder it, you don't know what you're missing. John Mellencamp's album is great so buy it.

September 23, 2014 @ 5:51 PM

Glen

The Alaskan anchor woman who quit her job live on air by saying "F*** this. I quit" was an idiot. Not for supporting the legalization of marijuana but for doing this.
Why would you burn bridges live on air? She could be a horrible business owner or the Alaskan government might change the legislation like Washington and Colorado did.
If all else fails she could have at least fallen back to TV anchoring.
Not anymore.
She's not a hero just incredibly immature


Here's the video....

September 23, 2014 @ 6:04 PM

Broni

I too have always presumed @this guest is male. But I have no idea why I made that presumption. Heck, she/he spouts beautiful and poignant poetry on a regular basis and I still presumed he/she was male.

My head just exploded.

September 23, 2014 @ 6:26 PM

this guest

Once again
you guys are great.
Mike attracts a fine crowd.

I'll say very little except
'mystery younger person'
(don't forget youth is relative)
was met on
social media, is overseas, and based
on involvements in verifiable activities
does not seem to be a case of
cleverly disguised damaged goods.
Right now the 'relationship' exists in the realm
of fantasy.
The speed bumps outside my window are
more real.

Argie and I exhibit the same personal failings
of temperamental intolerance
jumping up and down
on opposite ends of the biplane wing.

thank you.

September 23, 2014 @ 6:58 PM

dale

Mayoral debate at my my Alma Mater - York Memorial Collegiate grad in 1975.

Haven't lived in Toronto since 1999.

Ironic that York Memo is in Francis Nunziata's ward - York South Ward 5.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:14 PM

Lorne

Okay, before I start, I want to thank Mike for creating this place and this community. I'm going to forewarn this will be long, I'm not going to edit it, and it's going to come from a place of emotion rather than logic. I'll try to stuff the jist of it into the following paragraph, so take that are your tldr.

Yesterday was the worst day of my life. After being in and out of the ER over the weekend, at 9am on Monday, we lost the baby. 17 weeks into the pregnancy, no lead up. No cause. My wife is fine, physically. We're both have taken the week off work to recover and regroup emotionally.

That was your tldr paragraph. This sucks. This absolutely fucking sucks. It isn't fair. And yes I'm completely goddamn aware that "life isn't fair". Shit happens, and it can happen at any time. I'm well aware that the entire universe is one big random jumble that includes more than enough helpings of "what the fuck". Intellectually, I know it. It doesn't make it any easier to deal with.

Especially not when it's riding in on a wave of unfair to begin with. We've been trying for two years before we got the positive. That's about six months on our own, and a year and a half in fertility treatments. You'd be surprised just how fast AND how slow time moves when you're living your life 28 days at a time. That's a lot of doctors appointments. Tests and pokes and prods and getting up early and getting blood drawn. Of course I was there every second of the time to support her. But-- okay, the routines for just one month. Get up fucking early, because the clinic opens at 7am and you need to be in line before that because it's first come first serve and you have to get to work on time. Take a number. Get blood drawn-- this will check to see if she's ovulating yet, because there's a whole host of things waiting for that moment. Repeat this a good 5-7 times until you get your positive. Rush back in the next day to get your medication administered, and to drop off a sperm sample. Get that processed, pick it up, return to the office. She gets an ultrasound. Turkey baster time! In it all goes. It's now almost noon, a half-day of vacation time used up. Come back in a few days, early of course, to start having bloodwork and ultrasounds done looking for pregnancy hormones.

Half the month's mornings are spent in the doctor's office. And chances are you'll get a negative beta (preg bloodtest). So you just wait for the period to start and end, and the cycle starts again! 28 days at a time. If I had to guess at the time spent just in the doctor's office, over that year and a half-- that's a good 200 hours. At least 144 blood draws. Nearly 100 injections of various medications meant to kickstart the ovaries. Probably at least 50 ultrasounds. Costs in the thousands of dollars-- and that's just what the insurance companies and OHIP didn't cover (thank fucking fuck we're in Canada, let me fucking tell you). Month after month after month after fucking month of heartbreak with each negative beta test. Twenty three months of that.

And then one month, lookie there, it worked! Beta levels are good. You're pregnant. Holy fucking shit, it's a joke, right? A mistake. There's no way this can be real. Being happy is something that only happens to other people. This will never happen to us. But there it is. Positive beta levels. A stick with two pink lines on it. The beta levels are doubling every 24-48 hours, as expected.

We know the stats. Shit like this goes south very quickly. 25% chance up to a certain point-- and we pass that point. 10% chance for a first trimester miscarriage. But hey, look at the bloodwork, it's good. And then the ultrasounds come on. Oh my fucking god, you have no idea what it's like to have gone through all this, for this long, and then suddenly to get called into the tech's office, she turns around the screen and boom, right there, clear as day-- it's all stuffed into a sac now, but it's there. Living. Your kid. Miscarriage down to 5%. Come back another day, and now you can see the head, the feet, the arms, the spine. The heart is beating, thump thump. Only two chambers, but going strong. You can put that picture on your phone, show it to friends and family. Second trimester comes. She's got her appetite. If you squint, she's starting to show. It's-- is it fucking SAFE to believe things will go okay? It's down to 2%. You can shop at Toy'R'Us, at Childrens Place. Buy outfits. Too soon for gender, but there's plenty of neutral things. Bunny clothes. "My first halloween". OHMYHGOD IT'S A PUMPKIN OUTFIT! What's the nursery going to look like? Does Costco deliver cribs?

You listen to the heartbeat every night on a doppler, nice and strong. Steady. I kept track of that on an Excel spreadsheet.

I started a blog to keep friends and family up to date. I started a secret section of the blog where I wrote to my itty bitty-- planned on keep track of their early years. One day I could hand that all over to them and they'll know about their past.

Things are just going to work out. A couple weeks we'll pass viability. The ultrasound tech will count fingers and toes. Maybe get to gender it. All the bloodwork will come back clean-- no genetic markers for anything wrong. We'll get the signoff from the specialist. We'll be handed off to an OB and just go about the rest of the pregnancy like a normal couple.

But no. Fucking no, of course not. All that work, all that effort, all that love and caring and hope and happiness and optimism. Nope.

Saturday my wife's not feeling great. Nothing that seems out of the ordinary. Some nausea. She can't quite get comfortable. Second trimester problems, amiright? Make sure she's got enough food, some ginger ale for the tummy, all's good. We even go see her father, help him shop for a new car. And then in the evening she wants to go home RIGHT NOW. She really doesn't feel good. She's worried. Something's not right when she pees. We rush home, get her comfy. Enough food? Enough tea? Just a stressful day, right? The heartbeat sounds find on the doppler. At around 1am on Saturday (sunday monring) she says no, things aren't great. She thinks there's blood, but can't be sure. We're different blood types. The doctor said in in no uncertain terms if there was any blood, go to emerg, get the RH shot. Okay, doctor said so, let's go. Markham-Stouffville hospital (they're a great hospital as a sidenote). Emerg checks us in. They draw blood, nothing seems wrong. They do an ultrasound. There's itty bitty like a Mexican jumping bean, making the doctor's life difficult by moving around. lol. That's my kid. They tell her nothing seems wrong, as far as they can tell. My wife knows she had a sub-corionic hemotoma (probably misspelled) at 9 weeks-- basically a bruise under the uterus. It probably just finally is working its way out.

The ER doctor says we need to see the specialist on monday. In the meanwhile, he writes a note for 2 weeks of bed rest. Kinda sucks, but we'll make it through. We get home 4 hours in the emerg. Send some emails to work. Watch a couple funny videos to unwind. Tomorrow will be a relax day. Sleep until 3pm. But the next day isn't much better.

She's still uncomfortable. Checking herself. Things don't feel right. I'm trying to be the optimistic one, as I always am for the two of us. Even if there is something wrong, I need to present the positive side of things. Keep her spirits up. Keep her happy. Stress is no good for a preggy lady. Make her smile, make her life. Worried shitless inside. 11pm comes, and there's more blood. Neither of us wants to go back to ER, but will if we have to. She calls Telehealth to check. She's worried she's leaking amniotic fluid-- basically that her water broke. Very bad sign at 17 weeks. The nurse isn't sure, says go to ER. We do.

The same nurses are on duty. They look worried. Check us in. It's busier that day. We wait, but not too long. More blood drawn. They're worried it's a urinary tract infection, so write a script for antibiotics. Give her a sample cup so they can run some tests. She provides the sample, and it's full of blood. She is in full terror mode. It's 2am. They do an ultrasound, and the baby is there, heart beat going. I can't tell if it's not as active as yesterday. But it's there. They say take the antibiotics. They need a higher resolution ultrasound, but can't do that in the ER. It's nearly 3:30am now, monday morning. Can we go home, see the specialist when they open in 3 hours? It'll be faster than trying to get the OB into emerg. Yeah, we can. They give her oxy for the pain.

We go home. I tell my wife get some rest. I'll stay awake, and come up with breakfast in a couple hours. It's 4am when I tuck her into bed. I go off to get some computer work done. I'll make bacon and eggs, she loves that, has plenty of iron and protein. We check the doppler again. It sounds good. I can't tell if the heartbeat is erratic, or if it's just my lack of sleep.

6:30 am, just before I make breakfast, my wife screams. I run upstairs, and she's doubled over in pain. She can't bear it. She's not even halfway through the dose of oxy. She's bleeding. I call 911, because she can't imagine getting in the car (we live exactly 6km away from the hospital and even then). Ambulance. Paramedics. I'm desperately trying to be positive for her, but she knows it's over. We don't know that. We don't know that.

I can't know that, because if I even think it's possible, I'm gone. And I need to be strong for her.

It takes a half hour to get checked into the ER. There aren't any beds yet. We should have been in the specialists appointment by now, getting the ultrasounds, getting told it's all okay, it's just normal. Instead we're in the ER and my wife is in the worst pain she's ever felt and there's blood and she knows. She knows.

The attending doctor can't find the baby on the ultrasound. She should have found it right away. There's only one place it can go. This isn't good. I refuse to admit it yet. No doctor or nurse will say it. Even if they know, they'll never say it. It isn't their job to, they can't say anything without evidence. My wife knows.

The OB on duty comes around. Excellent woman, very experienced, very compassionate. She doesn't get down to the ER much. Why should she? Pregnancies aren't supposed to go like this. She can't find the baby with the ultrasound either. There's only one thing she can do, which is look. Gloves on. Speculum in.

What she says next are words that will never leave me, and are the point when any hope vanished.

"I can see Baby".

There's nothing left to do but cut the cord and remove it. They go to prep, and my wife and I can do nothing but cry. Our baby is dead. Gone. A heartbeat just a few hours ago, and now-- nothing. My wife tries to say she's sorry, and I won't hear it. It isn't her fault, and she can't feel that way. There's no reason. No explanation. There never will be. Life's just unfair sometimes.

The OB and her assistance in training (what a fucking day to be trained) do what they need to. My wife needs to see baby. I look away. This little bundle has been in my heart and in my hopes and dreams for too long now. I know them, in my own way-- as ultrasound pics, as a tummy bump, as a heartbeat on a doppler, as a future I knew was going to be great. As more love than I can ever put into words. I know myself. If I see them now, that's all I'll ever be able to remember them as. I look away. My wife sees ten toes and ten fingers and-- and she says, perfect. Everything was perfect.

It's over. Baby is taken away to pathology. We'll still never get any answers. It's 9am of the worst day of my life, and the day isn't over. The hospital-- the nurse, the OB, the ultrasound tech, the social worker who sees us-- are all amazing. Compassionate. My wife's mother rushes over to comfort us and help in anyway she can. She had a miscarriage once, and she said hospitals didn't used to give a fuck about you like this. It's amazing. Thank you Markham-Stouffville.

Everything from then on is all procedure. It moves slow because my wife isn't at risk and there's no baby to care for. That's how triage works. The placenta is out. The ultrasound confirms it. We wait hours upon hours upon hours to find out if she needs surgery or not. The social worker asks us if we need a burial or a pastor or anything like that. No. That isn't us.

I ask a couple times if they can use anything for scientific research. No. Can they use the cord blood? The OB couldn't even get a needle in the cord, it was so small. Please, can they use anything-- can anything at all good come of this? No.

They make a memory box for us, with handprints and footprints and pictures. Maybe one day I can look inside that box. Not today. Maybe it's just another form of denial, of avoidance. I know the baby is gone. I know there's nothing left inside my wife. But I-- I need to remember them my own way, instead of that way.

Finally, after way to long, thank fuck she doesn't need surgery. The specialist calls with her condolences, wants to see us on Friday. We do want the medical report from that meeting. We're not ready to think of next steps yet.

We get my wife dressed, her mom drives us home. It's nearly 6pm. I've been up for over 24 hours. My wife's at least had some snoozes on the morphine drip. We're starving. We need comfort. We order sushi, because she needs the iron after so much blood loss, and it's not like it'd hurt the-- yeah.

Phone calls need to be made. My work, to let them know I'll be away for the week. I work at a very understanding company, for which I'm grateful. My parents, who were worried something was wrong when I didn't get back to them when they landed from their vacation. Her father, who is without words. She sends emails to her work to let them know. Everyone is shocked. "Oh no". Sad. Each phone call is living the day over again.

I make a very brief post to Facebook. "Today has not been a good day, and this isn't a good post". We ask please for no phone calls. We need to be along to recover and recoup.

Today we packed up all the baby things and put them in a box in the closet for now. Maybe one day we'll be in a position to use them again.

We're going to buy a memory box. Put away the ultrasound pictures, the hospital's memory box, and the first sleeper we bought. Everything that's never going to be used again. Each thing I pack away makes me cry again, knowing it's over. It's gone. It's dead.

All the literature says to take care of yourself. My wife's thankfully in good health. We're taking the week off work. Tomorrow we're going to pamper ourselves-- a massage, nice lunch out, whatever we need. Friday is back into doctor's appointments. I've made an appointment with a psychologist for myself. I struggle with depression as it is. I know that no matter how well I cope with this, my brain is broken and will need help.

Without warning, at any given moment, it all comes back in floods and we cry. We're each others' rock. We'll get through this-- together.

Will we try again? I don't know. Will we adopt instead? I don't know. We aren't willing to give up. That's all I know.

It's hard. It's so fucking hard. And unfair. Everything we put into it. All the time, the money, the doctors appointments, the literal blood. Dedication. It's been a fucking hard, uphill struggle. We've experienced everything aspect of infertility so far-- I really didn't fucking need to experience this, too. What was the point? Fucking why? I've heard people say "maybe there was something wrong with the baby, and this was for the best". Fuck that. FUCK THAT. Even if it is true, then why was there anything wrong in the first place? Fuck fuck FUCK that. After so much love and effort and hope-- two years of trying, so much medical attention-- so much of everything-- leading up to a glimmer of hope only to have it snuffed out and taken away. It hurts so much more. So much more.

It isn't fair. I was a dad for 17 weeks, and now I'm not. I was going to teach them to cook. Play board games with them. Watch them grow up and experience the world and find their place in life and fall in love. I wanted to spend life time with them, and instead only got 17 weeks, and got to be there when they died in an emergency room.

My kid-- I can say you were alive for 17 weeks. I can say you were the size of an onion. What I can't say is how much you were loved, or how big of a hole in my heart you leave. Both are beyond measure.

Goodbye, my itty-bitty.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:18 PM

Lorne

(again, apologies for the length. That was cathartic, and again, thank you Mike for running these open forums)

September 23, 2014 @ 8:19 PM

GUNTer

so very very sorry Lorne.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:32 PM

this guest

Jeez Lorne. So sorry.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:35 PM

this guest

Jeez Lorne. So sorry.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:35 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Lorne

Aw shit, I'm so sorry for your loss.

September 23, 2014 @ 8:47 PM

Jamie

Lorne I don't know you but that made me cry.... I'm so sorry for your pain and loss. My wife and I lost 3 due to miscarriage and we have 2 girls today one is 5 and the other just 3 weeks, she was born at just 32 weeks gestation but we got her home now and she's doing well. Having 2 live births won't ever replace the loss of 3 babies gone.

One day my man I pray you will be blessed with another child and I'm sure you will be a great dad again just as you were with your itty-bitty.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:02 PM

J9

@Lorne. So sad to hear of your loss. Heartbreaking.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:05 PM

Al The Royal Pain

So sorry for your loss @Lorne, I can't begin to imagine what you two are going through. As painful as it is now, I hope you guys don't give up trying.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:06 PM

Andrew

Lorne,

Words can't express how sorry I'm am here to hear this. Take this time for the two of you.
May you find happiness and peace soon.

Andrew

September 23, 2014 @ 9:11 PM

Rick C in Oakville

Thoughts are with you and your wife Lorne. I can't imagine the emotional toll this has taken on you two.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:13 PM

Sarah Foster

Dearest Lorne,

First of all, I'm so, so sorry for your loss.

Back in February, my husband and I also lost our baby. It took six weeks for me to fully lose the baby, including a trip to a walk-in abortion clinic. We never heard our child's heartbeat. It died around its ninth week (though we didn't learn about it until just before we hit our 12th week).

This summer has been particularly hard for me, as I watched my sister, and seemingly everyone else in the world, get pregnant and have babies. My due date was Sept. 13. My sister gave birth on Sept. 21.

There are no words that will help you and your wife during this time, I know that; But I want you to know that you both will be able to move forward. You never move past it, or move on, but you move forward.

I will be thinking of the both of you. Take the time you need to grieve, to heal.

Please reach out if you ever need someone to listen. I'm happy to do it.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:30 PM

dale

My sincere sympathies & condolences to you & your family Lorne.

Keep Strong.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:32 PM

Lorne

Thank you for the kind words; they help. @jamie especially. Knowing there's some light at the end of the tunnel-- no matter how long the tunnel-- is always, always worth hearing.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:32 PM

Broni

@ Lorne
I only know of you through this blog but I am very sorry to hear what has happened to you. Your post was tough to read but please know that it was read right through, word-by-word...and I appreciate that Mike's blog gave you the outlet to say what you are thinking & feeling.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:35 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Lorne

Before my first son was born, we tried for two years and suffered through a 12 week miscarriage.

Then came James.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:38 PM

Alvin

Lorne, truely sorry for your lost,

September 23, 2014 @ 9:41 PM

Jamie

Be strong my man and never give up hope. We had been trying for 4 years to get pregnant. Every month my wife would cry when she got her period. We went to clinics as well but decided to try clomid pills and it worked for us. It does get better but the pain never goes away completely. You can't replace a child with another one but you can love them just the same and even more.

September 23, 2014 @ 9:56 PM

Tim

Lorne the world is full of little miracles who came after horrible losses. Keep trying, keep strong and just when you are about to give up the miracle will happen. As I channel our friend Cheryl, in her imitable style..."you wait Lornes wife will get pregnant again you'll see and the baby will love Bob Seger and the habs will win the cup and my trainer will win the bonnspeil....man I hate grocery gateway but love primus."

God bless you man

September 23, 2014 @ 9:59 PM

Liz

@Lorne

I've done a lot of crying lately for other reasons but reading your post, well, I just sobbed and sobbed. So raw and honest, heartfelt and heartbroken. I read every syllable.

I'm genuinely sorry that you and your wife - two obviously incredible people - were dealt this hand. Please take good care of each other. You both deserve it and more.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:08 PM

Rick2

Lorne, I am so sorry to read that.. take the time to heal.
We have been through similar. I will keep it short, but we went through IVF as well. After 2 ectopic pregnancies, and lots of false starts, and many years later, our luck changed - We started the process when I was 36 and by the time I was 44 years, our son came into the world - he is now 9. All the hard times, with the drawing blood, early morning visits to the clinic, went away with that. We tried for another, and lasted another round, and decided to count our blessings with our son... so, I hope the 2 of you find a way, at some point, to continue on. I wish the both of you the best.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:12 PM

Marie

Lorne, so sorry for your loss.

September 23, 2014 @ 10:20 PM

Lorne

@Sarah: Everyone else getting pregnant... that was (and I suspect will be) one of the hardest things to deal with. You very much want to be happy for their happiness, but it just feels like a reminder of your own "failure". I'm sorry for your loss, too.

@jamie: We're hoping that, if we try again, and need assistance, to hop right to injections. Chlomid at half, full, then double dose didn't work. The dr. suspects combo male factor, and low follicle production. Letrizole injection + IUI worked, so hopefully we can start there.

@Rick2: I'm glad it worked out for you, and I can't imagine there could be any more love in the world than you and your wife have for your son. =) We were at risk of ectopic-- two follicles matured, only one took, so there was a lot of monitoring over that. It's a scary thing to even think about.

September 24, 2014 @ 12:21 AM

Lorne

@Mike: I never knew that about you-- so glad James happened. You're a great dad. It's funny-- every time I've ever talked to literally anyone about any part of infertility, there's one of two response. "I know, I went through it too", or "Someone within 1 degree of separation of me went through this". Literally, every single time. It's mind-blowing how, for lack of a better term, "common" it is. Infertility-- it's something like 1/4 to 1/6 people experience it. Maybe more, and they just don't know it. Miscarriage, depending on the reports you read-- up to 25%!

And yet, no one talks about it. Part of it is some people just don't know-- like, they try for a baby, and one day it happens, and they just don't think about the months in between. Or they know, and it just isn't something that gets talked about. Which is horrible, because sharing and hearing others stories and struggles and getting advice is the most helpful thing. Knowing you aren't alone.

I mean, nearly every other medical malady has been de-stigmitized. You can talk about cancer treatments. People know, or they understand. And they can help. More and more each day, you can talk about mental illness. People know, or they understand. And they help.

Infertility is the last medical issue "we just don't talk about". And yet...

Actually, Mike-- you know what? Right now everything's a bit raw, but give me a little bit of time, and do you think we could chat about this on a podcast? I know how much having people to talk to-- and hearing stories from others-- has helped me. I would love to do the same for others.

September 24, 2014 @ 12:28 AM

Cheryl

Lorne, this is so sad. Sorry for your loss. It's awful. Well, how about those Orioles. They won 5 to 4. Ubaldo Jiminez won another game. I guess he's improving. I didn't have faith in him at first, but great that he is winning. Homers were by Nelson Cruz, Kelly Johnson and Nick Markakis. also the Jays are officially eliminated because the Royals won. Also in preseason hockey, my habs beat the Bruins in a close game 3 to 2. Well, John Mellencamp's album is a must have. You have to get it. He is the other king. Bob Seger's album is out soon, October 14.

September 24, 2014 @ 4:41 AM

debra

Long time reader, first time posting

Lorne, my heart is breaking for you.
I hope the tears I cried can somehow comfort you.
like if I cry them you don't have to.

September 24, 2014 @ 6:54 AM

this guest

last night's debate:
Chow booed when she brings up mayor's scandals hitting front pages. "Go home Olivia! Back to China!" shouts one man.
(picked that up off twitter)

only one word to describe the braying minions of ford nation:
lumpenproletariat
fascinating word and worth reading the history of how political movements
have been empowered by disenfranchised ruffians.

September 24, 2014 @ 8:23 AM

this guest

last night's debate:
Chow booed when she brings up mayor's scandals hitting front pages. "Go home Olivia! Back to China!" shouts one man.
(picked that up off twitter)

only one word to describe the braying minions of ford nation:
lumpenproletariat
fascinating word and worth reading the history of how political movements
have been empowered by disenfranchised ruffians.

September 24, 2014 @ 8:23 AM

this guest

last night's debate:
Chow booed when she brings up mayor's scandals hitting front pages. "Go home Olivia! Back to China!" shouts one man.
(picked that up off twitter)

only one word to describe the braying minions of ford nation:
lumpenproletariat
fascinating word and worth reading the history of how political movements
have been empowered by disenfranchised ruffians.

September 24, 2014 @ 8:24 AM

Philly-Bob

@ Lorne - I have no words my friend, that is heartbreaking.

I'd like to add the words of comfort that my sister went through a year and a half of trying to get pregnant (which included loosing 2 babies herself). She is now the proud Mother of 2 amazing boys.

When you have your child (and I believe you will) that kid will be so lucky because you and your wife will love that kid all the more for the effort it took to bring him/her into the world.

Stay strong, for you and your wife.

September 24, 2014 @ 8:25 AM

this guest

don't know how the multiple posting happened
just meant to say that
once re: 'debate'

September 24, 2014 @ 8:25 AM

Boomer

@ Lorne - It was very hard to read your ordeal. I am so sorry.

September 24, 2014 @ 9:33 AM

Douglas

@ Lorne - Unfortunately, I can relate to what you and your wife have gone through. I offer my sympathy as well as empathy. Taking time off for both of you is a good step forward. I hope you find strength in each other and in your love for each other. My story kind of ends "well", blessed with two great now-late-teen boys, a legacy to what was once a better time for my then-wife and me. Going through what we did with our first two pregnancies, learning what we did, one fact still strikes me: Considering what seems like a nearly infinite amount of things that can go wrong in pregnancy, it is amazing that so many are born healthy. Each birth can truly be called a "miracle".

September 24, 2014 @ 10:43 AM

James Edgar

@Lorne words fail me. I'm so sorry you and Your wife have had to go through this. My best wishes to you both.

September 24, 2014 @ 11:57 AM

519 Rob

@Lorne

Fuck man.
I started to read your post last night and couldn't finish it.
I just read it now at work, and I'm trying not to cry sitting at my desk.
Might be the most powerful things I've ever read.
My best wishes for you and your wife.
Rob

September 24, 2014 @ 1:21 PM

elvis

So sorry for you Lorne.

September 24, 2014 @ 1:34 PM

this guest

Apologize for adding debate stuff to a thread that went into
more deeply personal matters.
And again Lorne, my deepest sympathies.

September 24, 2014 @ 4:56 PM

Cheryl

Well, you're right I hate Grocery Gateway. At times they are okay but today they screwed up. They sent me a substitute of something. I didn't want it so I told the driver I don't want it and to take it back, but the idiots who packed the boxes put it in the bottom so the driver couldn't find it. Well, I found it at the bottom of one of the boxes. Well, I called customer service and the girl I talked to said that they pack the boxes in any order so the substitutions may not be in an easy place for the driver to find and she went on saying to keep it and give it back with my next order hoping I remember to give it back. Anyway, I suggested that they do something to the web site like give you a choice if you want your default to be substitutions checked or not checked. They said they can't do it. Most customers want substitutions. Anyway, I emailed the manager and she did credit me for the item, but I still have to give it back. Anyway, how about those Orioles. They won. It was a very very long game though. I wish there was a time clock in baseball. Long games still get to me, but Bud Norris was the winner. It was 9 to 5. The Yankees are done. The Orioles are going to win the World Series. It will be awesome.

September 24, 2014 @ 6:20 PM

Teunis

Mike, what ever happened to Humble Howard's lady friend? He used to talk about her all the time and then suddenly we haven't heard squat in weeks.

September 24, 2014 @ 7:57 PM

Toronto Mike Verified as the defacto Toronto Mike

@Teunis

That's not my story to tell.

September 24, 2014 @ 8:09 PM

Lorne

@guest: I'm sorry for taking over the thread. I'll try to do something more upbeat on Friday. I'm sure it will be good for all of us. =)

September 24, 2014 @ 8:46 PM

Lynne

@Lorne

Nothing anyone can say or do will ease the pain of losing a child, so I won't even try. In fact, many of the things you have probably heard by now from well-meaning sympathizers only make it worse.

Be strong, be weak, be whatever you need to be right now.

I've been there.

September 25, 2014 @ 8:57 AM

Broni

@ Lorne
Don't apologize for taking over the post. It was the most important and meaningful thing I can remember reading on this blog. It helped me remember the stress of when my first daughter was born and there were complications during birth, and that's something I should never ever forget or take for granted. If anyone should apologize, it's anybody who posted on another topic since then, instead of waiting for the next Open Mike.

September 25, 2014 @ 10:40 AM

Philly-Bob

Seconding what Broni said. We're all connected Lorne, and if sharing in a forum like this helps you get through this time, then there's nothing to apologize for.

The Ford's will still be idiots on Friday....this Open Mike's for you Brother!

September 25, 2014 @ 10:43 AM

Cheryl

I got some more junk mail today from someone wanting to send me an American Express card. I don't need it. I hate junk mail. Anyway, Grocery Gateway did not win an award for being Best Customer Service. They're not. There was something I did not want substituted. I forgot to check off that I didn't. Grocery Gateway think of things to substitute things with. They don't ask you what you want as a substitute. Anyway, they do not have the best customer service, believe me. Anyway, hopefully my Orioles win tonight although that game means nothing really. They'll mean something next week though. Hockey doesn't mean anything now as well, but I prefer hockey. Colorado is at my Habs tonight. I can get it. John Bartlett is no longer announcing for my Habs, it's someone else. I think he's okay though, but I'll miss John.

September 25, 2014 @ 4:57 PM

Cheryl

I hate Derek Jeter. The good thing is he is retiring. Anyway, he had to win in a walk off over my Orioles. This sucks. My Orioles lost 6 to 5, but lots of homers for my orioles, Nick Markakis, Alejandro De Aza, Adam Jones and Nelson Cruz, but they blew it and that sucks. I hate Jeter and I'm so glad he's retiring. Good riddance. I hate the Yankees. I love the Orioles. Well, my Habs won last night 3 to 2 over the Avs. PK Subban had a three point night, a goal and a couple assists. Max Pacioretty and Alex Galchenyuk also scored. Anyway, Grocery Gateway sucked this week. They really don't have good customer service. If they screw up, they screw up.

September 26, 2014 @ 6:45 AM

CAMILLE

My name is Camille bruno Valdez my partner and I have been trying for a baby for over two years now, We were going to a fertility clinic for about 5 months before somebody told us to contact this spell caster who is so powerful, We contacted him at this email; [redacted], for him to help us, then we told him our problem, he told us that we will either conceive in February 2014 or March 2014,but after two years of trying we were at a point where we were willing to try anything. And I'm glad we came to Dr Dahiru, Because his pregnancy spell cast put us at ease, and I honestly believe him, and his gods really helped us as well, I am thankful for all he has done. contact him via email: [redacted] if you are trying to get a baby or want your lover back. he has powers to do it, he has done mine,

October 1, 2014 @ 12:04 PM

Philly-Bob

A spell. Did she really, in 2014, try to convince us that a spell allowed her to have a child.

Hey Camille - I have a lovely bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

October 1, 2014 @ 1:03 PM

Leave a comment


Only 89 comments? C'mon, we can do better... Leave a comment above and let's keep this conversation going!


« The Power of Now Rob Ford, Doug Ford and the Crazification Factor »